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Picture by Santosh Ghosh |
Calcutta: Pakistan’s World Cup-winning captain Imran Khan, who is fast gaining ground as a politician (he heads the Tehreek-e-Insaf), spoke to The Telegraph on Monday evening.
Imran spent the day in the city and will head home on Tuesday.
The following are excerpts
Do you see yourself as Pakistan’s Prime Minister-in-waiting?
Put it this way… Unless my party makes big mistakes by selecting the wrong candidates or makes a wrong alliance, I don’t think any political party in Pakistan can stop us from sweeping the next elections. I say that because the people have already decided. A very vibrant media has raised the level of political awareness. The people have now rejected the two principal parties who have both been in power. Their leadership, which has billions outside the country, has been exposed by the media.
Have there been lines of communication between you and the army and has the army sounded you out on heading a national government?
Why should I first of all (be in communication)? Unless I have the mandate with me, I cannot make any changes in Pakistan or bring about radical reforms, which the country needs to survive. Now, if you reform on someone’s shoulder or someone else’s is the power behind you, then they dictate to you. The only way you can make changes is through a massive mandate from the people. If I don’t get that mandate, I don’t want the power. I would much rather sit in the opposition… A national government is the weakest government. You need a strong government to initiate reforms and that comes from a massive mandate.
The general impression is that you are on excellent terms with the army…
Look, the army cannot bring the people out of their houses… The maximum crowd that (General Pervez) Musharraf had was 30,000… We’ve had a quarter of a million people in Lahore and a quarter of a million people in Karachi. The only other time such crowds came out were for Zulfiqar Ali Bhutto, 40 years ago.
Do you see the huge numbers as a good omen?
No, it’s not about an omen… Pakistan has changed… When I was here last year, I’d told you that we would sweep the next elections… People had then laughed at me. It’s been a steady change in the last three-four years and, suddenly, now you have the full numbers come out.
There is talk that you could strike a deal with General Musharraf… Is something on?
Well, Musharraf is not even in Pakistan.
But he does intend returning home…
Musharraf will not come to Pakistan because there is a serious threat to his life. The threat to my life would be from the political mafia, who are scared that I will stop their plunder and loot… Musharraf’s threat is from those people who believe that he is responsible for the deaths of so many in Baluchistan and in other places where he sent the army… You don’t mess with them… How is he going to go out in public? He has no party and to have one, he needs to be with the public.
Wednesday (February 1) appears to be the day of reckoning, isn’t it?
That’s when the Supreme Court is probably going to decide whether or not President Asif Ali Zardari has immunity from criminal cases. When Richard Nixon could not have immunity on a trivial case like phone-tapping, this guy has $60 million lying in Swiss bank accounts which he cannot account for… He is hiding behind an immunity. I don’t think any Supreme Court is ever going to say that the President is above the law.
Today, as we speak, what’s the future you see for President Zardari and Prime Minister Yusuf Raza Gilani?
Bleak… In any case, they have only got about a year left... They have no public support... The people are sick of them and the country is going through the worst period in its history.
What’s your take on the Memogate scandal?
It’s a very serious allegation that the President of the country asked his ambassador in the US to get help against the army, basically to serve American interests better… The Supreme Court has appointed a judicial commission, but the attitude of the government suggests we will not get to the bottom of this.
You are perceived to be anti-US. Don’t you think that the US will oppose your coming to power?
First of all, anti-US basically means anti-geography. It’s like anti-Asia, anti-Australia, anti-Africa. It means nothing. There are so many diversities in the US itself… I have been perceived to be anti-American because I have been against this war on terror. Now, the majority of the American people are themselves anti these military operations and this war on terror... I am not anti-India, but I am anti the Indian policy on Kashmir, where you have hundreds of thousands of troops. But that does not mean I am anti-India.
Can we expect a betterment in Indo-Pak relations if you are in the ‘hot seat’ at some point in the future?
The answer is yes, because I think this is the time for a completely new beginning. You need to have a new relationship. Having said that, I hope, you know, that ours (Tehreek’s) will be a strong leadership. In other words, a leadership that can take responsibility and can take big decisions. I hope the leadership in India will be able to respond.
But your views on Kashmir are those of a hardliner…
There’s a UN resolution on Kashmir, but when you sit down on the dialogue table, you work things out… That is what democracy and dialogue do. You come to some sort of a consensus which suits everyone. As for the hardline bit, I don’t believe in a military solution. Full stop. Whether it is the Pakistan army in Baluchistan or the Americans in Afghanistan or whether it is the Indian army in Kashmir, this (acting by force) is not a solution because you alienate people even more. I wouldn’t say mine is a hardline position, it’s a liberal one. No liberal believes in a military solution.
Being a Lahore boy, you recently attracted lakhs at a rally in Karachi. Did the turnout surprise you?
No, because Pakistan has changed. I was the one who was consistently saying that the country has changed... The people are seeing it now. People are coming out in massive numbers because they are sick of the (old) politicians and (the more established) political parties.
What are your priorities?
No.1 is to fix the governance system, which means cleaning up corruption… No.2 is tackling the grave energy situation. We have a massive energy shortage and my party will soon be having a seminar where we will come out with our energy policy… No.3 is education… In fact, we need an education-emergency… No.4 is revenue collection.
Credibility is your strongest suit…
My credibility is strong because that’s what the other politicians don’t have. People want the government they can trust. They want a leadership which does what it says. And you should lead by example… In other words, if you want to fight corruption, start with yourself.
Do you have a role model in politics?
I would say (Mohammed Ali) Jinnah has been my Pakistani icon, the only politician I’ve looked up to in Pakistan… People who have done very well and are great role models for us are Lee Kuan Yew in Singapore, Mahathir bin Mohamad in Malaysia, (Recep Tayyip) Erdogan in Turkey and Lula (da Silva) in Brazil. All excellent leaders.
What’s the first thought you wake up with every morning?
I am always optimistic. No matter how beaten I used to be in a cricket match, when I woke up the next day, I would be full of optimism, ready to fight. That’s my attitude to life. No matter how bad things look as I am going to sleep, I will still wake up all cylinders firing and ready to go.
The last thought of the day…
I just try and assess the day before I go to sleep.
You do?
Yes. I try and assess the whole day. The highs and the lows… This is also from my cricketing days.
What do the youth want?
Change. In Pakistan certainly, they are sick of the corrupt system. They want radical reforms, they want job opportunities, they want an educational system that prepares them for the future, for the 21st century, which has already begun.
The last one… Well-wishers keep fingers crossed where your safety is concerned. Now, at least, do you have a proper security detail?
There is a limit to how much security I can have. I am probably the least protected politician, but then that’s not how you look at life. You cannot live life fearing death.
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